The system is working beautifully. The shafting is about to begin and most can not identify the causes. Face the facts. Money does not grow on trees, the welfare state is over. Socialism has sucked everything dry. Cowen and Kenny don't give a bollix obout anyone but themselves, why should they.

This has happened countless times in history so why is it a surprise. John Law destroyed France in 1720 using the exact same method of phoney money.

What did ye expect.

When I said that the middle class were going to be completely reduced to paupers I was laughed at.

This is nothing compared to what it will be in a few months when the dole checks stop

Waiting for the Rapture youngdan? Otherwise, what is your solution? I would say at least half the people who post here recognise the system is banjaxed. You are not alone there.

They do not recognise it. Some other poster referred to someone saying "it just happened" It did in it's bollix just happen. It was impossible mathematically for it not to happen

You think the Euro is massively overvalued youngdan ? Could you say by how much - you seem to be able to predict how far these things will drop.

Didn't he say the ISEQ would be at 1,000 before the end of 2008?

youngdan wrote:

They do not recognise it. Some other poster referred to someone saying "it just happened" It did in it's bollix just happen. It was impossible mathematically for it not to happen

The someone was a Fianna Fail Minister. The poster said the same thing as you just did.

It is difficult to say which ministers do not understand what is happening from those who do but are feathering their own nests. Those feathering their own nest are divided into 2 groups. Those just skimming as in the accepted fashion and worried about their seats and those who are selling out the country.

The sell outs can easily be seen to have the interests of the Davos powerfull over the welfare of the Irish. They can be recognised by the oil treasure worth hundreds of billions being given to the money masters

I could go on but what is the point. All the crying over 2 billion while 200 billion is sitting there

With all the weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth there is a cut of 60 million from the overseas aid. WTF is going on when Cowen gives away 800 million a year while this is happening as follows-- Of the small number of posters here there seems to be about 10 unemployed but willing to work. One man gets the shaft for his redundancy while the bondholders get a bailout, another man gets 52 euro a week dole after employing others and being self employed. Thankfully for his own sanity he has not calculated the amount of taxes he generated for the state.

An early wake up call to reality was when a first time auther was paid a million euro while not even Stephen King could expect a sum like that.

Must the picture be painted more clearly.

It may be well to remember that Rosa Luxembourg was murdered by the army on the orders Social-Democratic Party government. There are always quite a few hurdles to get over in social change, and in Germany the rising was crushed. Had it succeeded, the situation of Russia would have been very different. http://www.revolutionarydemocracy.org/rdv5n1/luxembrg.htm

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

youngdan wrote:

It is difficult to say which ministers do not understand what is happening from those who do but are feathering their own nests. Those feathering their own nest are divided into 2 groups. Those just skimming as in the accepted fashion and worried about their seats and those who are selling out the country.

The sell outs can easily be seen to have the interests of the Davos powerfull over the welfare of the Irish. They can be recognised by the oil treasure worth hundreds of billions being given to the money masters

I could go on but what is the point. All the crying over 2 billion while 200 billion is sitting there

With all the weeping and wailing and gnashing of teeth there is a cut of 60 million from the overseas aid. WTF is going on when Cowen gives away 800 million a year while this is happening as follows-- Of the small number of posters here there seems to be about 10 unemployed but willing to work. One man gets the shaft for his redundancy while the bondholders get a bailout, another man gets 52 euro a week dole after employing others and being self employed. Thankfully for his own sanity he has not calculated the amount of taxes he generated for the state.

An early wake up call to reality was when a first time auther was paid a million euro while not even Stephen King could expect a sum like that.

Must the picture be painted more clearly.

I'm afraid so Dan, that's as clear as mud.

Quote :

There is an argument for letting the banks go bust. It may cause turmoil but it will be a cheaper way to deal with this in the end. The British Parliament never offered a blanket guarantee for all liabilities and derivative positions of these banks," he said.

Mr Stiglitz said the Government should underwrite all deposits to protect the UK's domestic credit system and safeguard money markets that lubricate lending. It should use the skeletons of the old banks to build a healthier structure.

"The new banks will be more credible once they no longer have these liabilities on their back."

Mr Stiglitz said the City of London would survive the shock of such a default because it would uphold the principle of free market responsibility. "Counter-parties entered into voluntary agreements with the banks and they must accept the consequences," he said.

Such a drastic course of action would be fraught with difficulties and risks, however. It would leave healthy banks in an untenable position since they would have to compete for funds in the markets with state-run entities.

Mr Stiglitz's radical proposal is a "Chapter 11" scheme for households to allow them to bring their debts under control without having to go into bankruptcy. "Families matter just as much as firms. The US government can borrow at 1pc so why can't it lend directly to poor people for mortgages at 4pc. ," he said.

Stiglitz can see what could be done, but he doesn't seem to see that it would be anathema to the present system to do it.

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

It remains to be seen who is going to find themselves out on their arses.

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

It remains to be seen who is going to find themselves out on their arses.

Just checked that out and that is not what was stated by PDFora.

They are to seek an assurance from the minister that they will not be used in a strike breaking role, they have not said what they would do if they were ordered to undertake such a role.

Let's at least try to keep basic information straight here.

The defence forces can make no such assurances. It is the role of the defence forces to do what they are told. You change what they are told to do by changing the Government.

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

It remains to be seen who is going to find themselves out on their arses.

Just checked that out and that is not what was stated by PDFora.

They are to seek an assurance from the minister that they will not be used in a strike breaking role, they have not said what they would do if they were ordered to undertake such a role.

Let's at least try to keep basic information straight here.

I'm quoting from RTE radio. I'll put a link up as soon as I can. Have you got a link to your source?

Can anyone see the Ard Taoiseach here ?

johnfás wrote:

The defence forces can make no such assurances. It is the role of the defence forces to do what they are told. You change what they are told to do by changing the Government.

Undoubtedly. It would be a sorry state of affairs if they were all to go down with the flu on the same day.

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

It remains to be seen who is going to find themselves out on their arses.

Just checked that out and that is not what was stated by PDFora.

They are to seek an assurance from the minister that they will not be used in a strike breaking role, they have not said what they would do if they were ordered to undertake such a role.

Let's at least try to keep basic information straight here.

I'm quoting from RTE radio. I'll put a link up as soon as I can. Have you got a link to your source?

My source is the PDFora site PDFora.ie, the horses mouth, so to speak.
If RTE put that out, as you quoted, they should be ashamed of themselves.

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

It remains to be seen who is going to find themselves out on their arses.

Just checked that out and that is not what was stated by PDFora.

They are to seek an assurance from the minister that they will not be used in a strike breaking role, they have not said what they would do if they were ordered to undertake such a role.

Let's at least try to keep basic information straight here.

I'm quoting from RTE radio. I'll put a link up as soon as I can. Have you got a link to your source?

My source is the PDFora site PDFora.ie, the horses mouth, so to speak.
If RTE put that, out as you quoted, they should be ashamed of themselves.

Well that would depend on what was said to them.

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

PDForra have announced today that they would not involve themselves in any strikebreaking in the event of public sector strikes.

They're in the army, they wiil do as they're told or find themselves, at best, out on their arse with no pension at all.

It remains to be seen who is going to find themselves out on their arses.

Just checked that out and that is not what was stated by PDFora.

They are to seek an assurance from the minister that they will not be used in a strike breaking role, they have not said what they would do if they were ordered to undertake such a role.

Let's at least try to keep basic information straight here.

I'm quoting from RTE radio. I'll put a link up as soon as I can. Have you got a link to your source?

My source is the PDFora site PDFora.ie, the horses mouth, so to speak.
If RTE put that, out as you quoted, they should be ashamed of themselves.

Well that would depend on what was said to them.

Well do clarify, you're the one making claims here.

That is a good picture Cactus. Especially the banner that says

"Listen to Youngdan"

that can be partially read on the right hand side

Quote :

PDFORRA, the representative association for soldiers, sailors and aircrew in the Defence Forces wishes to state that in the event of industrial action emerging from the imposition of the pension levy, it will be seeking an assurance from the Minister for Defence, Mr Willie O’Dea, TD that soldiers will not used to as strike breakers.

Gerry Rooney also said “It will be morally wrong for soldiers to be ordered to break strikes arising from the imposition of the pension levy. Soldiers support the opposition being expressed across the Public Service to this unfair pension levy and believe it should be settled through further discussions with ICTU’s Public Sector unions including PDFORRA”.

Members of the Defence Forces have been used in the past used during strikes, such as bus strikes, ambulance strikes etc.

PDForra.ie

RTE say that PDFORRA " have informed the Minister that they don't want to be used as strikebreakers"

javascript:playClip(null,null,209,'http://dynamic.rte.ie/quickaxs/209-rte-drivetime-dri-marywilson.smil')

It will be interesting to see how that will play out.

cactus flower wrote:

Quote :

PDFORRA, the representative association for soldiers, sailors and aircrew in the Defence Forces wishes to state that in the event of industrial action emerging from the imposition of the pension levy, it will be seeking an assurance from the Minister for Defence, Mr Willie O’Dea, TD that soldiers will not used to as strike breakers.

Gerry Rooney also said “It will be morally wrong for soldiers to be ordered to break strikes arising from the imposition of the pension levy. Soldiers support the opposition being expressed across the Public Service to this unfair pension levy and believe it should be settled through further discussions with ICTU’s Public Sector unions including PDFORRA”.

Members of the Defence Forces have been used in the past used during strikes, such as bus strikes, ambulance strikes etc.

PDForra.ie

RTE say that PDFORRA " have informed the Minister that they don't want to be used as strikebreakers"

So not as you reported then.
It doesn't matter what they want ot don't want, they're in the Army, they'll do as they're ordered or leave the Army.

youngdan wrote:

That is a good picture Cactus. Especially the banner that says

"Listen to Youngdan"

that can be partially read on the right hand side

No Dan, That would be the young FG'ers, out there trying to save the national finances.

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

Quote :

PDFORRA, the representative association for soldiers, sailors and aircrew in the Defence Forces wishes to state that in the event of industrial action emerging from the imposition of the pension levy, it will be seeking an assurance from the Minister for Defence, Mr Willie O’Dea, TD that soldiers will not used to as strike breakers.

Gerry Rooney also said “It will be morally wrong for soldiers to be ordered to break strikes arising from the imposition of the pension levy. Soldiers support the opposition being expressed across the Public Service to this unfair pension levy and believe it should be settled through further discussions with ICTU’s Public Sector unions including PDFORRA”.

Members of the Defence Forces have been used in the past used during strikes, such as bus strikes, ambulance strikes etc.

PDForra.ie

RTE say that PDFORRA " have informed the Minister that they don't want to be used as strikebreakers"

So not as you reported then.
It doesn't matter what they want ot don't want, they're in the Army, they'll do as they're ordered or leave the Army.

Always happy to correct an error. Also happy to see that the army don't want to strike break.

cactus flower wrote:

tonys wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

Quote :

PDFORRA, the representative association for soldiers, sailors and aircrew in the Defence Forces wishes to state that in the event of industrial action emerging from the imposition of the pension levy, it will be seeking an assurance from the Minister for Defence, Mr Willie O’Dea, TD that soldiers will not used to as strike breakers.

Gerry Rooney also said “It will be morally wrong for soldiers to be ordered to break strikes arising from the imposition of the pension levy. Soldiers support the opposition being expressed across the Public Service to this unfair pension levy and believe it should be settled through further discussions with ICTU’s Public Sector unions including PDFORRA”.

Members of the Defence Forces have been used in the past used during strikes, such as bus strikes, ambulance strikes etc.

PDForra.ie

RTE say that PDFORRA " have informed the Minister that they don't want to be used as strikebreakers"

So not as you reported then.
It doesn't matter what they want ot don't want, they're in the Army, they'll do as they're ordered or leave the Army.

Always happy to correct an error. Also happy to see that the army don't want to strike break.

See above for the importance of "want"