So what's it like to be a woman?

Yeah, I've run out of anything else to talk about.

I only tried it once, was pretty good.

I'm thinking of becoming a woman in my next life when I get reincarnated. Is it any good?

It's amazing.

*Phenomenal Woman, by Maya Angelou*

Pretty women wonder where my secret lies.
I'm not cute or built to suit a fashion model's size
But when I start to tell them,
They think I'm telling lies.
I say,
It's in the reach of my arms,
The span of my hips,
The stride of my step,
The curl of my lips.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

I walk into a room
Just as cool as you please,
And to a man,
The fellows stand or
Fall down on their knees.
Then they swarm around me,
A hive of honey bees.
I say,
It's the fire in my eyes,
And the flash of my teeth,
The swing in my waist,
And the joy in my feet.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

Men themselves have wondered
What they see in me.
They try so much
But they can't touch
My inner mystery.
When I try to show them,
They say they still can't see.
I say,
It's in the arch of my back,
The sun of my smile,
The ride of my breasts,
The grace of my style.
I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

Now you understand
Just why my head's not bowed.
I don't shout or jump about
Or have to talk real loud.
When you see me passing,
It ought to make you proud.
I say,
It's in the click of my heels,
The bend of my hair,
the palm of my hand,
The need for my care.
'Cause I'm a woman
Phenomenally.
Phenomenal woman,
That's me.

A woman? You mean that thing that cooks for me? I don't know I concentrate on the food when I eat.

I only hope it could make less noise when washing dishes as I watch TV though.

I've gone to post on this thread three times and each time decided that what I was going to say could easily be misconstrued so I deleted the whole lot and walked away.
I'm still unsure about even posting this because once I become involved in the thread I know I'm going to say something I regret.

Quote :

I'm still unsure about even posting this because once I become involved in the thread I know I'm going to say something I regret.

Wonderful; a bit of misconstruction is great fun on a Wednesday night.

AfricanDave wrote:

I've gone to post on this thread three times and each time decided that what I was going to say could easily be misconstrued so I deleted the whole lot and walked away.
I'm still unsure about even posting this because once I become involved in the thread I know I'm going to say something I regret.

Ah come on ! Now what are you going to say ?? Let your Anima speak, Brother

I was going to say that 50 years ago I wouldn't have wanted to be a woman but nowadays it's probably better to be a woman.
I think men are being discriminated against a bit more.
Obviously nothing like what women must have gone through years ago but it's not easy to be a man now.
Also I find that most women are incredibly sexist.

edit - Ok after a bit of consideration I've decided that that last comment is a bit trollish. I only really added it to stir up a reaction but I stand by it.

AfricanDave wrote:

I was going to say that 50 years ago I wouldn't have wanted to be a woman but nowadays it's probably better to be a woman.

I probably wouldn't have wanted to be a woman fifty years ago either. My grandmothers lived very tough lives, one widowed with five small children - twice over, and the other on a small farm with very little money and a lot of heavy work. There were poor education opportunities, a lack of employment opportunities, social inequality - you know all the rest.

Quote :

I think men are being discriminated against a bit more.

Where do you see that?

Quote :

Obviously nothing like what women must have gone through years ago but it's not easy to be a man now.

It's not easy to be a man in the sense that the automatic respect that our fathers enjoyed now has to be earned, but there are great emotional and social supports for men that never existed in the past.

Quote :

Also I find that most women are incredibly sexist.

I see this in my mother's generation, rather than mine. Hers is the first generation of Irish women to divorce and separate and their anti-man sentiments are very strong because, I suppose they came out of an era that elevated men to the pinnacle of the family and society and learned that while their men had feet of clay, their society - legal system, employment still supported men and ignored the needs of women.

And I think younger women (18-25) have almost no respect for men and that is very, very worrying for young men.

I do agree with your post mostly, kate, but I think most women I've come across are quite sexist, not just the older generation. Women tend to group together against men a lot moreso than men do against women.
One way of explaining this is looking at a night out in the pub. If there's a group of girls and only one man, the girls tend to gang up and take the piss out of the man, where as if it's the other way around, the men tend to attack each other to make themselves look better in front of the girl..... if you know what I mean.

On the discrimination against men - I see it quite a lot in advertising. I know this has been commented on before so I won't go into too much detail, but a lot of ads seem to make the man out to be thick and immature, while the woman is made out to be the voice of knowledge and reason.
There's also the whole family law thing but we won't go into that now.

AfricanDave wrote:

I do agree with your post mostly, kate, but I think most women I've come across are quite sexist, not just the older generation. Women tend to group together against men a lot moreso than men do against women.
One way of explaining this is looking at a night out in the pub. If there's a group of girls and only one man, the girls tend to gang up and take the piss out of the man, where as if it's the other way around, the men tend to attack each other to make themselves look better in front of the girl..... if you know what I mean.

On the discrimination against men - I see it quite a lot in advertising. I know this has been commented on before so I won't go into too much detail, but a lot of ads seem to make the man out to be thick and immature, while the woman is made out to be the voice of knowledge and reason.
There's also the whole family law thing but we won't go into that now.

Hmm family law is probably better not gone into now. But you're right about the advertising. Though I could easily say that there were hundreds of years of stereotyping women as angels of the house up until the 60s. And the man was the wise and knowledgeable one to whom women deferred on all matters except the domestic.

Social bullying of men is quite prevalent. I wonder where that comes from?

Kate P wrote:

Though I could easily say that there were hundreds of years of stereotyping women as angels of the house up until the 60s. And the man was the wise and knowledgeable one to whom women deferred on all matters except the domestic.

That would, however, form the basis of an argument that far from having a respectful equality, we should develop a reverse inequality. I don't think I could agree with that.

I'm not arguing it, I'm just pointing it out. I wonder do some situations like this tip the balance too far in the wrong direction before they balance out.

Kate P wrote:

Social bullying of men is quite prevalent. I wonder where that comes from?

I have also wondered where this stems from and I wonder if it is, like johnfás mentioned, a form of reverse inequality.
It kind of strikes me as being similar to white people's apparent fear of criticising any minority in case they're seen as some kind of racist.
It seems like men aren't really allowed to stand up for themselves because our grandfathers treated their wives like crap.
Although the other way of looking at it is saying that men's instinctive way of standing up for themselves is using their fists and that's not really acceptable anymore.
This is me hypothesising and rambling so ignore any part you don't agree with.

I would imagine there is an element of it. I would also say that it is incumbent on men not to accept it. If it is accepted, why would it not kindle like it can in the opposite direction.

Kate P wrote:

Quote :

Obviously nothing like what women must have gone through years ago but it's not easy to be a man now.

It's not easy to be a man in the sense that the automatic respect that our fathers enjoyed now has to be earned, but there are great emotional and social supports for men that never existed in the past.

What emotional and social supports? Socially we have lost out big time. I'm not saying this is a bad thing but it's true. And emotional supports can be a burden. I'm not an emotional person. Call me unreconstructed and aloof but that's how I am. But that's a sin nowadays, you have to be emotional. If not, you're like the gay fellow from the fifties, you're the freak.

For plenty of men the acceptance of emotion was probably a great release but I'd hate for you to think that it was good for all men. To me it's an additional burden.

Women live longer than men and have happier old ages, so the stats say.

They have a lot less power than men.

Whatever grabs you really.

cactus flower wrote:

They have a lot less power than men.

Oh I don't know about that. Much of the power most men enjoy is illusionary.

Since people are, understandably, shy of wading into the heavy men-vs-women issues, I'll just say that I'm reminded of the punchline of this sketch:
http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=4Kwh3R0YjuQ

soubresauts wrote:

Since people are, understandably, shy of wading into the heavy men-vs-women issues, I'll just say that I'm reminded of the punchline of this sketch:
http://ie.youtube.com/watch?v=4Kwh3R0YjuQ

"she's travelled...she's been to Purley"..

lovely stuff.

Squire wrote:

cactus flower wrote:

They have a lot less power than men.

Oh I don't know about that. Much of the power most men enjoy is illusionary.

Would you elaborate on that Squire?

She thinks women are more clever and let men think they enjoy real power.

But many men - like ME - are so clever they let women think they let men think they enjoy real power.

Or maybe she is so more clever that she lets men think they let women think they let men think they enjoy real power.

Or maybe... errr... were was I here ?

In January 1960, a reporter for the London Standard approached Churchill at a reception.
"Sir Winston, what is your comment on the prediction made the other day that in the year 2000, women will rule the world?"

"They still will, will they?" was Churchill’s grunted response