The Privatisation of Irish Politics

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

cookiemonster wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

I take your point. "Bankrolling" would suggest he's giving them money, which I doubt. Still, it's interesting that he chose to use COIR as a distribution chain - a good fit, I guess. Libertas had the money to buy anti-Treaty stuff, COIR has existing grassroots activists, but no money to do much other than shout a lot and print bad pamphlets. Plus they wouldn't understand the marketing aspects of giving out someone else's branded material, or wouldn't care. They're hardly in it for the recognition.

That, of course, suggests Libertas-Coir meetings - something I think Hermes alluded to way back.

ibis wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

I take your point. "Bankrolling" would suggest he's giving them money, which I doubt. Still, it's interesting that he chose to use COIR as a distribution chain - a good fit, I guess. Libertas had the money to buy anti-Treaty stuff, COIR has existing grassroots activists, but no money to do much other than shout a lot and print bad pamphlets.

There is nothing to suggest Coir were chosen as a distribution chain. It certainly wasn't my experience. Also, COIR had no shortage of cash, but curiously nobody is asking any questions about that.

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Eh well - as a campaigner for the Yes Side last time out - I know where you are coming from - having suffered physical attack from Coir (see these pages circa May-June this year) and having noted how well funded they were - I have my suspicions about that one too - you'll never be able to prove it - the fact of the matter is that in general the YES campaign ran the most incompetent,badly organised campaign in living history - even worse than Nice I - a decent co-ordinated grassroots campaign would have won it easily - I know - in the consitutency where Libertas spent the most money,staged the most stunts - We had the best Yes grassroots campaign and cleaned up by a margin of 4-1 in those areas that Libertas advertised and leafleted most heavily - why - because we canvassed the doorsteps and went out of our way to explain the damn treaty - Sinn Fein did well in their area of the constituency - because they canvassed - but even so - the SEIC is the equivalient to Fallujah to FG - we targeted 3 inner city districts and held SF to a dead heat in 2 and won the other one - it could have been done - but FF went awol on the ground - FG didnt bother explaining its importance to most of its members who took the opportunity to put one over on FF - Labour were utterly befuddled and unprepared and let SF take them on the rail - thus the campaign was a disaster.

I couldnt give a damn how well funded the No side were - The Yes side totally lost what should have been a shoo in - the least contraversial treaty in the history of the EU in that it involved welcome restructuring and reform of the commission and parliament - but none of the issues that it was rejected on.

Edo wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Eh well - as a campaigner for the Yes Side last time out - I know where you are coming from - having suffered physical attack from Coir (see these pages circa May-June this year) and having noted how well funded they were - I have my suspicions about that one too - you'll never be able to prove it - the fact of the matter is that in general the YES campaign ran the most incompetent,badly organised campaign in living history - even worse than Nice I - a decent co-ordinated grassroots campaign would have won it easily - I know - in the consitutency where Libertas spent the most money,staged the most stunts - We had the best Yes grassroots campaign and cleaned up by a margin of 4-1 in those areas that Libertas advertised and leafleted most heavily - why - because we canvassed the doorsteps and went out of our way to explain the damn treaty - Sinn Fein did well in their area of the constituency - because they canvassed - but even so - the SEIC is the equivalient to Fallujah to FG - we targeted 3 inner city districts and held SF to a dead heat in 2 and won the other one - it could have been done - but FF went awol on the ground - FG didnt bother explaining its importance to most of its members who took the opportunity to put one over on FF - Labour were utterly befuddled and unprepared and let SF take them on the rail - thus the campaign was a disaster.

I couldnt give a damn how well funded the No side were - The Yes side totally lost what should have been a shoo in - the least contraversial treaty in the history of the EU in that it involved welcome restructuring and reform of the commission and parliament - but none of the issues that it was rejected on.

Very true. I still think FF completely misjudged it, and thought it would be enough of a shoo-in that they could let FG and Labour carry it, so as to keep their warchest for the locals. If they'd had an ear to the ground, they'd have known by February it wasn't going to be like that.

cookiemonster wrote:

ibis wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

I take your point. "Bankrolling" would suggest he's giving them money, which I doubt. Still, it's interesting that he chose to use COIR as a distribution chain - a good fit, I guess. Libertas had the money to buy anti-Treaty stuff, COIR has existing grassroots activists, but no money to do much other than shout a lot and print bad pamphlets.

There is nothing to suggest Coir were chosen as a distribution chain. It certainly wasn't my experience. Also, COIR had no shortage of cash, but curiously nobody is asking any questions about that.

Well, on the one hand, Coir have been around a long time, so if they have money it's not a surprise. However, in respect of Coir handing out Libertas material, I've now heard that several times. I don't expect you to be able to say whether they were chosen as a distribution chain or not.

On that subject, a video that was put out under the auspices of We Are Change Ireland was in Dave Cochrane's name originally - I recall how livid he was that qtman mentioned it before it was ready for release.

cookiemonster wrote:

ibis wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

I take your point. "Bankrolling" would suggest he's giving them money, which I doubt. Still, it's interesting that he chose to use COIR as a distribution chain - a good fit, I guess. Libertas had the money to buy anti-Treaty stuff, COIR has existing grassroots activists, but no money to do much other than shout a lot and print bad pamphlets.

There is nothing to suggest Coir were chosen as a distribution chain. It certainly wasn't my experience. Also, COIR had no shortage of cash, but curiously nobody is asking any questions about that.

Well Cookie - they probably fell off the back of a lorry

I cant prove it - but knowing Libertas' head of communications as well as I do - I wouldn't put it past him - for him - every campaign is total war - my enemies enemy is my friend etc etc - Normally I would be on the same team as him -and I had to buy the drinks in Beckys that weekend - low down scheming bastard - takes one to know one tho

Edo wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

ibis wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

I take your point. "Bankrolling" would suggest he's giving them money, which I doubt. Still, it's interesting that he chose to use COIR as a distribution chain - a good fit, I guess. Libertas had the money to buy anti-Treaty stuff, COIR has existing grassroots activists, but no money to do much other than shout a lot and print bad pamphlets.

There is nothing to suggest Coir were chosen as a distribution chain. It certainly wasn't my experience. Also, COIR had no shortage of cash, but curiously nobody is asking any questions about that.

Well Cookie - they probably fell off the back of a lorry

I cant prove it - but knowing Libertas' head of communications as well as I do - I wouldn't put it pass him - for him - every campaign is total war - my enemies enemy is my friend etc etc - Normally I would be on the same team as him -and I had to buy the drinks in Beckys that weekend - low down scheming bastard - takes one to know one tho

Printed campaign materials are the same as cash for a campaign. They cost a lot. It is interesting that Libertas linked in to a ready made distribution chain with the fanatics of COIR

ibis wrote:

Well, on the one hand, Coir have been around a long time, so if they have money it's not a surprise. However, in respect of Coir handing out Libertas material, I've now heard that several times. I don't expect you to be able to say whether they were chosen as a distribution chain or not.

What you expect or don't expect is immaterial. I worked with the campaign team in Dublin and I know, for a fact, that campaigners where chosen carefully (or at least as carefully as possible given the circumstances) and while there were communications with COIR and some may have obtained Libertas material but I can say that in Dublin at least they were never "chosen as a distribution chain".

Frightened Albanian wrote:

Edo wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

ibis wrote:

cookiemonster wrote:

Art wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - t

Edo, its not as simple as that. I have a member of Cori living close to me. I get on well with her but politically shes for the birds. Anyway her house is still full of t-shirts, bollons, pens, flyers etc all with anti-lisbon treaty messages on it. She spent day after day at train stations and street corners giving it away and still she has it. She can keep it for the next time. But it was Libertas that supplied her with all this stuff, therefore not only is Ganley bankrolling Libertas hes doing the same for Coir. Now do you understand the threat the contry is facing?

Art wrote:

yeah the penny's dropping, think how many of us will be around in November.

Yes, the t-shirts, pens and flyers were branded with Libertas, not sure about the posters.

Do you see how what you have said is incorrect?

I take your point. "Bankrolling" would suggest he's giving them money, which I doubt. Still, it's interesting that he chose to use COIR as a distribution chain - a good fit, I guess. Libertas had the money to buy anti-Treaty stuff, COIR has existing grassroots activists, but no money to do much other than shout a lot and print bad pamphlets.

There is nothing to suggest Coir were chosen as a distribution chain. It certainly wasn't my experience. Also, COIR had no shortage of cash, but curiously nobody is asking any questions about that.

Well Cookie - they probably fell off the back of a lorry

I cant prove it - but knowing Libertas' head of communications as well as I do - I wouldn't put it pass him - for him - every campaign is total war - my enemies enemy is my friend etc etc - Normally I would be on the same team as him -and I had to buy the drinks in Beckys that weekend - low down scheming bastard - takes one to know one tho

Printed campaign materials are the same as cash for a campaign. They cost a lot. It is interesting that Libertas linked in to a ready made distribution chain with the fanatics of COIR

Oh for crying out loud! You're taking the word of 2 yes campaigners and their sister or something and again, running it as fact. Are you a total fool?

cookiemonster wrote:

Auditor #9 wrote:

Edo wrote:

Ah Jayus Lads - can we give this whole Libertas craic a rest?

A) - for the anti-Libertas gang - every word you write is just giving them more publicity - 90% of the population havent a clue who Libertas are - most of them fell for the Coir and SF arguments in the Last Referendum campaign - Libertas were a sideshow who completely failed in the target constituency and Declan Ganley is just another talking head and IMO its just the Late Jimmy Goldsmith circa 1994 all over again - one big shock splash - talks about uniting the whole Europe behind anti-Brussels banner and then a spectacular belly flop at the next electoral test followed by a swift retreat into the shadows in the near after - I'll bet my first born son on the same happening this time.

Cookie - take a chill pill and ease off will ya - Deco has not answered any question relating to his past to anybodys satisfaction and the fact that Libertas have to respond in their website in the form of others peoples questions just emphasises that - come out with some real detailed policies and folks would start taking you seriously and not being so suspicious - you're taking this all too personally for a person who only signed up yesterday relatively speaking - First love and all that - but stand back and take a bit of perspective here - Im s member of FG - but for fks sake - if we had no policies and Endas financial and public life was as , how shall I put it, non defined as Dec- well Id have me crash helmet on too and would have to take the brickbats coming my way

my two cents - over and out

Anyone going to address Edo's post ?

I think he's wrong.

Is that it? -

Well I can see why you stick to discussing in detail those great issues of the day like the distribution of libertas pens, balloons and posters - 99% of Libertas' Raison d'etre is probably printed on them

Nity Nite folks - lets all wake up tomorrow and talk about the real issue of the day - How will Santa deal with the recession? Will there be a much needed 10% reduction in the volume of filled christmas stockings? - Will he take Aldi Milk and biscuits as a goodwill gesture?

cookiemonster wrote:

ibis wrote:

Well, on the one hand, Coir have been around a long time, so if they have money it's not a surprise. However, in respect of Coir handing out Libertas material, I've now heard that several times. I don't expect you to be able to say whether they were chosen as a distribution chain or not.

What you expect or don't expect is immaterial. I worked with the campaign team in Dublin and I know, for a fact, that campaigners where chosen carefully (or at least as carefully as possible given the circumstances) and while there were communications with COIR and some may have obtained Libertas material but I can say that in Dublin at least they were never "chosen as a distribution chain".

"May have obtained" and "house full of the stuff" are different concepts. And the WACI video?

Well I don't know anything about official policies. But I do know for a fact that members of COIR and We Are Change, distributed lots of Libertas material during the campaign. I've seen boxloads of pens etc. and I know that they weren't stolen.

Hermes wrote:

Well I don't know anything about official policies. But I do know for a fact that members of COIR and We Are Change, distributed lots of Libertas material during the campaign. I've seen boxloads of pens etc. and I know that they weren't stolen.

Those are an interesting pair to pick, though. Why those two? Not themselves interested in 'brand', perhaps, or lacking strong left-wing orientation. Of course, Caroline Simmons - now of Libertas - is also Pro-Life Campaign, who in turn share their address with COIR. Why WACI though? Simply a convenient front group for releasing viral material?

Also, on Cookie's point, the pro-lifers are indeed no stranger to SIPO questions. Nothing new under the sun - roll on the anti-everything brigade, now in suits for the convenience of the press.

<thiS thread has thrown up an interesting avenue of enquiry for S
IPO. the reason to use such groups is that they are highly motivated and easy to work with given Libertas anti abortion associations. Was Caroline Simons the go between? She still has her foot in the Pro Life Campaign as well as being a potential Libertas candidate.

ibis wrote:

Hermes wrote:

Well I don't know anything about official policies. But I do know for a fact that members of COIR and We Are Change, distributed lots of Libertas material during the campaign. I've seen boxloads of pens etc. and I know that they weren't stolen.

Those are an interesting pair to pick, though. Why those two? Not themselves interested in 'brand', perhaps, or lacking strong left-wing orientation. Of course, Caroline Simmons - now of Libertas - is also Pro-Life Campaign, who in turn share their address with COIR. Why WACI though? Simply a convenient front group for releasing viral material?

Also, on Cookie's point, the pro-lifers are indeed no stranger to SIPO questions. Nothing new under the sun - roll on the anti-everything brigade, now in suits for the convenience of the press.

Now there's the question of the night/morning. I can see why COIR would carry the torch. WAC are a whole new story. WAC, or at least some of its members would be opposite in outlook and politics. I didn't believe (or rather, want to believe) that they'd teamed up when I first heard it. But team up they did (WAC and COIR that is). These guys are living out an 'end times' scenario - COIR an almost biblical one and WAC a literal one. Funny thing is, even if Lisbon were not an issue, these folks would be exactly where they are now. Ever tried to reason with someone who honestly believes that global warming is a capitalist/masonic/them conspiracy and that Darwin's work was responsible for the Holocaust? Scary music time. And as you say, they've donned suits. They've even been abroad on a number of occasions. I could go on and on.

Mr. Ganley is going to have fun when he tries to let go of this particular tar-baby.

I predict a mess in the coming year. It won't be short on entertainment though.

cookiemonster wrote:

I know, for a fact, that campaigners where chosen carefully (or at least as carefully as possible given the circumstances)

I know it's hard to control the message when a large group of recruits are involved, but my funniest moment the day before the vote was being approached by a Libertas person - T-shirt and baseball cap emblazoned- asking if I had read the Treaty. When I asked why she was working for Libertas she replied that she was 'anti-capitalist'. Honestly. I suggested that she might have a read of the Libertas charter.

I'm pretty sure that wasn't cookiemonster.

Heres the wiki gig on the Late Jimmy Goldsmith for those of you lazy feckers who couldnt be arsed - ie all the anti Lisbon folks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Goldsmith

and please tell me you see no similarities what so ever with Deco Ganley - I think its quirkly the same!

I am familiar with Goldsmith as he was a trader and gambler of renoune. I
thought Ganley was a religous family man whereas Goldsmith was a rake of the highest order. Ganley came from nothing whereas Goldsmith came from extreme wealth and social standing.

Maybe they look alike. From the little I know of Ganley he
would be insulted to be compared to Goldsmith.

youngdan wrote:

I am familiar with Goldsmith as he was a trader and gambler of renoune. I
thought Ganley was a religous family man whereas Goldsmith was a rake of the highest order. Ganley came from nothing whereas Goldsmith came from extreme wealth and social standing.

Maybe they look alike. From the little I know of Ganley he
would be insulted to be compared to Goldsmith.

I think you would want to give Ganley a little credit he has a neck like a jockey's b*******. Religious man v. rake? Where do you get them?

Edo wrote:

Heres the wiki gig on the Late Jimmy Goldsmith for those of you lazy feckers who couldnt be arsed - ie all the anti Lisbon folks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Goldsmith

and please tell me you see no similarities what so ever with Deco Ganley - I think its quirkly the same!

I've heard this comparison before - I can see a few differences as well as some similarities. You could say Berlusconi, or any right wing businessman who crosses over to politics. What stops more from doing it I guess is that they make more money and have as much or more influence by staying in business and buying politicians.

There is no substantial third party evidence that I have ever seen that Declan Ganley made a business fortune before 2007 (there are reports of various contracts in 2008 that I have not looked in to). All the information out there seems to be very vague, based on interviews with him in the Press and he has always taken care to say he is not a billionaire. He has nothing like the business form that Goldsmith had. Goldsmith was a maverick who was wealthy enough to be able to make maverick choices ( The wiki is very poor I think - it leaves out his whole sellout before the recession and his attempt at establishing a south american environmental shangri-la").

What was your point, btw Edo?

cactus flower wrote:

Edo wrote:

Heres the wiki gig on the Late Jimmy Goldsmith for those of you lazy feckers who couldnt be arsed - ie all the anti Lisbon folks

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/James_Goldsmith

and please tell me you see no similarities what so ever with Deco Ganley - I think its quirkly the same!

I've heard this comparison before - I can see a few differences as well as some similarities. You could say Berlusconi, or any right wing businessman who crosses over to politics. What stops more from doing it I guess is that they make more money and have as much or more influence by staying in business and buying politicians.

There is no substantial third party evidence that I have ever seen that Declan Ganley made a business fortune before 2007 (there are reports of various contracts in 2008 that I have not looked in to). All the information out there seems to be very vague, based on interviews with him in the Press and he has always taken care to say he is not a billionaire. He has nothing like the business form that Goldsmith had. Goldsmith was a maverick who was wealthy enough to be able to make maverick choices ( The wiki is very poor I think - it leaves out his whole sellout before the recession and his attempt at establishing a south american environmental shangri-la").

What was your point, btw Edo?

There is no evidence except claims in articles from Gnaley fan mag CNBC that state Ganley is worth eg 300 mil. It is obviously something Ganley wants paopla to believe as he hosts that article on hos website.
There are many claims from Ganley's moutrh about huge turnover eg he claimed Kipelovo forestry turned over 150 mil $ in 1996. The accounts of Ganley companies for the years to 1997 give no hint to this.
Is it the case that he cultivates the image of a super rich man or is he super rich? if the latter is the case where did he mpake his money?