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 Moonies for Libertas

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PostSubject: Moonies for Libertas   Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:08 pm

Libertas have gained yet another influential ally: the Washington Times, a right wing tabloid founded by the Reverend Sun Myung Moon's Unification Church.

wiki on Moonies Newspaper

The Washington Times has published a story attaching Lucinda Creighton and FG for their assertion that Libertas is backed by right wing US interests and has links with the US Military and Security Services, through its founder Declan Ganley.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Wed Apr 30, 2008 9:09 pm

Link to Washington Post Story

The article quoted an unnamed "Libertas spokesperson".

The article states:

The businesses of both Ulick McEvaddy and Declan Ganley are heavily dependent on contracts from the State Department, the Pentagon and U.S. government agencies.

"I believe that these men are a lot less concerned about Irish sovereignty and the wording of the Lisbon treaty than they are about the potential hit to their own personal business interests," Ms. Creighton writes in the Web posting.

The businessmen lead a campaign group called Libertas, which is campaigning against the treaty's ratification.

The Libertas spokesperson was quoted as saying
"The contents of that statement are utterly without any foundation in fact, and represent a naked attempt to win a ... vote by stirring a nasty anti-American sentiment"

A State Department official noted yesterday that President Bush has strongly supported EU and NATO expansion into Eastern Europe in recent years, and has pushed strongly for a NATO invitation for former Soviet states Georgia and Ukraine at the alliance's Bucharest summit earlier this month.

The article was published to coincide with Bertie's visit.

Thanks for kerrynorth for this one.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Wed Apr 30, 2008 10:28 pm

I quite like the way that "President Bush has strongly supported EU and NATO expansion into Eastern Europe in recent years" does not answer the claim that US neo-cons oppose further EU integration, while managing to look like it does.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 1:22 am

DC really doesn't like Lucinda Creighton, does he?
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 12:48 pm

Ronald Binge wrote:
DC really doesn't like Lucinda Creighton, does he?
I'm starting not to like her, the silly clot. What sort of stupid thing was that to say? Poor FG will have some back-pedalling to do; this certainly hasn't helped their cause. Let's hope it doesn't become widely known. Have the Irish media piked up on this yet?
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 1:18 pm

905 wrote:
Ronald Binge wrote:
DC really doesn't like Lucinda Creighton, does he?
I'm starting not to like her, the silly clot. What sort of stupid thing was that to say? Poor FG will have some back-pedalling to do; this certainly hasn't helped their cause. Let's hope it doesn't become widely known. Have the Irish media piked up on this yet?

There seems to be a bit of a backlash against Libertas, who for some reason are suspected of having given the story to the US press.

It is certainly interesting to see FG and also FF (Dick Roche) having identified Libertas as promoting a rightwing US libertarian agenda.
They would neither party have any track record in this direction. Does this mean that they have finally chosen Brussels over Boston?
Is the collapse of the dollar and the US's fragile economic state influencing this choice? I think this might be worth a thread in its own right.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 2:00 pm

I have read the allegation that a certain member of Libertas has a personal issue with Lucinda Creighton. Does anyone know what that personal issue is? I know it may be dangerous to post it on a public forum, but I would be greatly endeared to anyone who would provide me with it.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 2:03 pm

There was some issue with Lucinda Creighton on Politics.ie. She had some 'public' (insofar as Politics.ie is public) spat with Dave on the website a few months ago. I remember there being quite a few thread on the issue though but they must have been deleted. The only one remaining from around the time is this in which Dave reassures us he didn't hack her website. Obviously it was stated at the time as he had had a recent run in with her. Can't exactly remember the details, so won't discuss it any further. A grudge was obvious held after though.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 3:37 pm

cactus flower wrote:

It is certainly interesting to see FG and also FF (Dick Roche) having identified Libertas as promoting a rightwing US libertarian agenda.
Have FG actually come out with this stuff? I wouldn't equate Lucinda Creighton's stance with FG's stance without some more senior source backing it.

I wouldn't expect much better from Dick Roche either, he's the one that's been telling us that Europe will boycott us and possibly invade and steal our children if we don't support the treaty.

I would consider it possible that Libertas gave the WT the story though, it ssems a little odd that they should pick it up. Surely Libertas could find someone a little more local though?
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 3:41 pm

905 wrote:
cactus flower wrote:

It is certainly interesting to see FG and also FF (Dick Roche) having identified Libertas as promoting a rightwing US libertarian agenda.
Have FG actually come out with this stuff? I wouldn't equate Lucinda Creighton's stance with FG's stance without some more senior source backing it.

I wouldn't expect much better from Dick Roche either, he's the one that's been telling us that Europe will boycott us and possibly invade and steal our children if we don't support the treaty.

I would consider it possible that Libertas gave the WT the story though, it ssems a little odd that they should pick it up. Surely Libertas could find someone a little more local though?

Is there anything that would make you think what was said about Libertas is not true?
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 4:11 pm

Oh, I have no opinion on the actual allegation themselves, other than I haven't seen any senior politicians bringing it up, I haven't seen any serious journalistic reports on the matter. I haven't looked for them either and you're welcome to correct me on this point.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 4:50 pm

cactus flower wrote:
These links were posted in our Libertas Roadshow thread.

L I N K with P.ie thread

L I N K with Creigthon FG website

L I N K Original Indy Article

Personally I like to judge by the person or group's own writings. Declan Ganley has written a number of papers (available on the internet) that are clear enough about his outlook, associations and politics.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 4:56 pm

riadach wrote:
I have read the allegation that a certain member of Libertas has a personal issue with Lucinda Creighton. Does anyone know what that personal issue is? I know it may be dangerous to post it on a public forum, but I would be greatly endeared to anyone who would provide me with it.

I know! Very Happy

- but after becoming one of the latest Globalization victims over the last 48 hrs - Im in enough shite as it is without wading into that swamp again.

Lets just say there was a falling out between comrades and now its personal!!!
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 5:06 pm

Edo wrote:
riadach wrote:
I have read the allegation that a certain member of Libertas has a personal issue with Lucinda Creighton. Does anyone know what that personal issue is? I know it may be dangerous to post it on a public forum, but I would be greatly endeared to anyone who would provide me with it.

I know! Very Happy

- but after becoming one of the latest Globalization victims over the last 48 hrs - Im in enough shite as it is without wading into that swamp again.

Lets just say there was a falling out between comrades and now its personal!!!

Well Edo, they say knowledge is power....
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 01, 2008 8:31 pm

905 wrote:
Oh, I have no opinion on the actual allegation themselves, other than I haven't seen any senior politicians bringing it up, I haven't seen any serious journalistic reports on the matter. I haven't looked for them either and you're welcome to correct me on this point.

In today's Irish Times (page 17), Mark Hennessey said

"Libertas, though it is only one part of the No campaign and not one whose views are shared by others calling for the same result, is the best-funded No lobby to date.

Privately, senior Government figures are keen to target its founder, Declan Ganley, particularly over his business ties with US defence companies. Playing the man, and not the ball, is sometimes a risky business in politics, and Ganley, perhaps in preparation, has moved somewhat into the the Libertas background in recent weeks."
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Sun May 04, 2008 7:41 pm

he's busy in america, busy with his company i think, search his name and see him talking about the emergency broadcast system contract for america, and how hes go the solution ot all of americas woes.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Sun May 04, 2008 7:46 pm

[quote="905"]
cactus flower wrote:

I would consider it possible that Libertas gave the WT the story though, it ssems a little odd that they should pick it up. Surely Libertas could find someone a little more local though?

they were trying to embarrass fine gael, if someone notices them bad mouthing american connections they might call up john bruton and he'd tell her to shush, simon rougheen has contacts with the neocons aswell trhough his work for goal.


Last edited by lostexpectation on Thu May 08, 2008 8:45 pm; edited 1 time in total
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Sun May 04, 2008 9:38 pm

lostexpectation wrote:
he's busy in america, busy with his company i think, search his name and see him talking about the emergency broadcast system contract for america, and how hes go the solution ot all of americas woes.

Our man is off at the seminars.

Link
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Mon May 05, 2008 10:58 pm

johnfás wrote:
There was some issue with Lucinda Creighton on Politics.ie. She had some 'public' (insofar as Politics.ie is public) spat with Dave on the website a few months ago. I remember there being quite a few thread on the issue though but they must have been deleted. The only one remaining from around the time is this in which Dave reassures us he didn't hack her website. Obviously it was stated at the time as he had had a recent run in with her. Can't exactly remember the details, so won't discuss it any further. A grudge was obvious held after though.

If anyone's interested, someone describing themselves as 'FineGaelinsider' has posted what they claim is the background to the Libertas/Creighton grudge in the comments section here (apologies for the rather shameless plug of the blog). As a rule, I tend not to take seriously anything written by anyone calling them 'insider' in any form and I don't really care about either Creighton or her enemies. Still you might find it amusing.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Mon May 05, 2008 11:06 pm

smiffy wrote:
johnfás wrote:
There was some issue with Lucinda Creighton on Politics.ie. She had some 'public' (insofar as Politics.ie is public) spat with Dave on the website a few months ago. I remember there being quite a few thread on the issue though but they must have been deleted. The only one remaining from around the time is this in which Dave reassures us he didn't hack her website. Obviously it was stated at the time as he had had a recent run in with her. Can't exactly remember the details, so won't discuss it any further. A grudge was obvious held after though.

If anyone's interested, someone describing themselves as 'FineGaelinsider' has posted what they claim is the background to the Libertas/Creighton grudge in the comments section here (apologies for the rather shameless plug of the blog). As a rule, I tend not to take seriously anything written by anyone calling them 'insider' in any form and I don't really care about either Creighton or her enemies. Still you might find it amusing.

He posted much the same on p.ie as "Mount St."...
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Mon May 05, 2008 11:09 pm

McGuirk was a member of FF and the Green Party who he was paid to work for at the same time as advising FG?????
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 08, 2008 3:09 am

"Fine Gael's anti-American statement might come as a surprise to some
observers, but it could also be an attempt to test the water on any
growth of disaffection with the U.S. in Ireland."


Ooooh. In a Washington newspaper. A rap on the knuckles for Fine Gael - the emerging radical "anti-american" opposition - probably the first time most US politicians will register their name Very Happy. They can't like that.
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 08, 2008 9:38 am

Given the newspaper involved I couldn't give a shite actually. Smile
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 08, 2008 10:33 am

chekov wrote:
"Fine Gael's anti-American statement might come as a surprise to some
observers, but it could also be an attempt to test the water on any
growth of disaffection with the U.S. in Ireland."


Ooooh. In a Washington newspaper. A rap on the knuckles for Fine Gael - the emerging radical "anti-american" opposition - probably the first time most US politicians will register their name Very Happy. They can't like that.

You obviously took note of which newspaper it was?
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PostSubject: Re: Moonies for Libertas   Thu May 08, 2008 11:08 am

cactus flower wrote:
You obviously took note of which newspaper it was?

Yep, but Washington has only got 2 papers and politicians read a lot of news.
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