Machine Nation

Irish Politics Forum - Politics Technology Economics in Ireland - A Look Under The Nation's Bonnet


Devilish machinations come to naught --Milton
 
PortalPortal  HomeHome  FAQFAQ  SearchSearch  MemberlistMemberlist  UsergroupsUsergroups  RegisterRegister  Log in  GalleryGallery  MACHINENATION.org  

Share | 
 

 St Patrick and Irish identity

View previous topic View next topic Go down 
Go to page : Previous  1, 2
AuthorMessage
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:15 am

cactus flower wrote:
Is St Brigid not said to have been a morphed goddess? something to do with milk?

I think there's too many similarities between the Celtic god Brigit and the saint to be just coincidence... Well, from what we can tell of the god anyway.

Patrick's very good, his Confessio is a brilliant work when considering the correlation between it and Exodus, and the reasons why he wrote his account like that... how it escaped academics for so long is beyond me!
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:43 am

BuachaillBeo wrote:
cactus flower wrote:
Is St Brigid not said to have been a morphed goddess? something to do with milk?

I think there's too many similarities between the Celtic god Brigit and the saint to be just coincidence... Well, from what we can tell of the god anyway.

Patrick's very good, his Confessio is a brilliant work when considering the correlation between it and Exodus, and the reasons why he wrote his account like that... how it escaped academics for so long is beyond me!

Got a link?
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Tue Apr 29, 2008 2:56 am

cactus flower wrote:
BuachaillBeo wrote:
cactus flower wrote:
Is St Brigid not said to have been a morphed goddess? something to do with milk?

I think there's too many similarities between the Celtic god Brigit and the saint to be just coincidence... Well, from what we can tell of the god anyway.

Patrick's very good, his Confessio is a brilliant work when considering the correlation between it and Exodus, and the reasons why he wrote his account like that... how it escaped academics for so long is beyond me!

Got a link?

How's your latin? http://www.ucc.ie/celt/published/L201060/index.html
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Tue Apr 29, 2008 3:18 am

riadach wrote:
cactus flower wrote:
BuachaillBeo wrote:
cactus flower wrote:
Is St Brigid not said to have been a morphed goddess? something to do with milk?

I think there's too many similarities between the Celtic god Brigit and the saint to be just coincidence... Well, from what we can tell of the god anyway.

Patrick's very good, his Confessio is a brilliant work when considering the correlation between it and Exodus, and the reasons why he wrote his account like that... how it escaped academics for so long is beyond me!

Got a link?

How's your latin? http://www.ucc.ie/celt/published/L201060/index.html

Lovely site Riadach. Latin is rusty though. My best bet would be to cross - read the Latin with a reasonable English translation.
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Wed May 14, 2008 11:01 pm

Sorry for not getting back to you Cactus.. I'd say you could get the Confessio as Béarla with a google search.

Fresh from my studying for Friday's exam - here's some similarities between the Confessio and what you get in Exodus

(the Confessio being written to justify his mission in Ireland, linking it to divine providence... providential history as the trend was at the time..)

Patrick: Born Christian but did not know 'the True God'
Exodus: The Jews ignore God

Both are put into enslavement

Patrick is led by a divine message to escape, while the Jews escape thanks to Moses - both are cases of divine intervention

Patrick escapes through the waters and the Jews escape through the Red Sea

Both wander the desert - the Jews for 4 decades and Patrick for 4 weeks

Both miraculously receive food by divine intervention (Manna in the Jews' case, a herd of swine in the case of Patrick after praying)

It's very interesting stuff like.... he had to justify his mission to his superiors and by linking it like this, it is he who is fulfilling OT prophecy, obeying the NT commandment to preach and even finishing the divine mission, by reaching 'the ends of the earth' - that is the fulfillment according to the prophecies and the commandments and it is by his linking like this that he can say it's his mission that it is... savage like Smile
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Wed May 14, 2008 11:05 pm

Thanks Buachaillbeo - did he make the connection explicit?

And who did he report to? If you are too busy I will go away and try googling.
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Wed May 14, 2008 11:16 pm

cactus flower wrote:
Thanks Buachaillbeo - did he make the connection explicit?

And who did he report to? If you are too busy I will go away and try googling.

Well like I don't think it was seen until relatively recently (in terms of the history of history anyway!), but i could be wrong. I think it was the case that scholars just took him at face value when he said he was 'most unlearned' and that. But if you read it with that in mind it's hard to not see the links. With the way scripture is written (especcially how the documents in the NT links Christ to the prophecies to the OT and so on) the linking isn't always exact detail for detail.. as in the differences between them are almost superceded by the 'bigger picture' of the whole thing (which explains why Christ wasn't accepted by all the Jews and that like... the links to the prophecies were ambiguous enough for Jews to rationally decide he was a fake.. it is in that way that documents of those times are written like... not every detail is exact but the linking itself is unambiguous)... I suppose that's the whole point of the conept of divine providence anyway...

Well like he wrote it because he was being criticised by ecclesiasts in the British church.. they said his mission was self serving and had heard of the sin which Patrick had confessed to a friend earlier in his life (he doesn't say what it is though).. he was considered unworthy of his mission and that and you can see that this dictated the reasoning behind the Confessio and how it's written and that. It was a stroke of genius though to do that.. facinating man, even if he didn't have anything to do with snakes, shamrocks and Armagh.... in fact... more facinating if he didn't have anything to do with them Very Happy
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Wed May 14, 2008 11:19 pm

ah you've me waffling on there like... why did you encourage me at all Razz
Back to top Go down
Guest
Guest



PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   Wed May 14, 2008 11:27 pm

BuachaillBeo wrote:
ah you've me waffling on there like... why did you encourage me at all Razz

Ah you so and so, you have got me interested. Is there anything reputable I can read without medieval Latin?
Well, I have a bit of Latin I suppose it could be used in extremis.
Back to top Go down
Sponsored content




PostSubject: Re: St Patrick and Irish identity   

Back to top Go down
 
St Patrick and Irish identity
View previous topic View next topic Back to top 
Page 2 of 2Go to page : Previous  1, 2
 Similar topics
-
» Hi..My name is Linda Irish...I wanted to say I am happy to find your site...
» any Irish sleevers???
» "Sybil Exposed" - dissociative identity disorder
» Queens Royal Irish Hussars, Wolfenbüttel 1964-68
» Dr Patrick Moore

Permissions in this forum:You cannot reply to topics in this forum
Machine Nation  :: History :: General History-
Jump to: