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 The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy

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PostSubject: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:17 am

Quote :

The New Hampshire state legislature took an unbelievably bold step today [4th Feb. 2009] by introducing a resolution to declare certain actions by the federal government to completely totally void and warning that certain future acts will be viewed as a "breach of peace" with the states themselves that risks "nullifying the Constitution."
http://digg.com/politics/NH_House_Resolution_HCR6

"Time to panic?" 2 mins

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CwIL7MRkqrs

Anyone know anything about this? (there are official links in his channel)
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:00 am

Are we heading into right to secede territory?
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:06 am

Nice find Audi, quick off the mark too.

Here's a link to the resolution itself: HERE.

Quote :
That the several States composing the United States of America, are not united on the principle of unlimited submission to their General Government; but that, by a compact under the style and title of a Constitution for the United States, and of amendments thereto, they constituted a General Government for special purposes, -- delegated to that government certain definite powers, reserving, each State to itself, the residuary mass of right to their own self-government; and that whensoever the General Government assumes undelegated powers, its acts are unauthoritative, void, and of no force; that to this compact each State acceded as a State, and is an integral party, its co-States forming, as to itself, the other party: that the government created by this compact was not made the exclusive or final judge of the extent of the powers delegated to itself; since that would have made its discretion, and not the Constitution, the measure of its powers; but that, as in all other cases of compact among powers having no common judge, each party has an equal right to judge for itself, as well of infractions as of the mode and measure of redress; and


That the Constitution of the United States, having delegated to Congress a power to punish treason, counterfeiting the securities and current coin of the United States, piracies, and felonies committed on the high seas, and offences against the law of nations, slavery, and no other crimes whatsoever; and it being true as a general principle, and one of the amendments to the Constitution having also declared, that “the powers not delegated to the United States by the Constitution, nor prohibited by it to the States, are reserved to the States respectively, or to the people,” therefore all acts of Congress which assume to create, define, or punish crimes, other than those so enumerated in the Constitution are altogether void, and of no force; and that the power to create, define, and punish such other crimes is reserved, and, of right, appertains solely and exclusively to the respective States, each within its own territory; and
Emphasis mine.

Quote :
That any Act by the Congress of the United States, Executive Order of the President of the United States of America or Judicial Order by the Judicatories of the United States of America which assumes a power not delegated to the government of United States of America by the Constitution for the United States of America and which serves to diminish the liberty of the any of the several States or their citizens shall constitute a nullification of the Constitution for the United States of America by the government of the United States of America. Acts which would cause such a nullification include, but are not limited to:


I. Establishing martial law or a state of emergency within one of the States comprising the United States of America without the consent of the legislature of that State.


II. Requiring involuntary servitude, or governmental service other than a draft during a declared war, or pursuant to, or as an alternative to, incarceration after due process of law.


III. Requiring involuntary servitude or governmental service of persons under the age of 18 other than pursuant to, or as an alternative to, incarceration after due process of law.


IV. Surrendering any power delegated or not delegated to any corporation or foreign government.


V. Any act regarding religion; further limitations on freedom of political speech; or further limitations on freedom of the press.


VI. Further infringements on the right to keep and bear arms including prohibitions of type or quantity of arms or ammunition; and


That should any such act of Congress become law or Executive Order or Judicial Order be put into force, all powers previously delegated to the United States of America by the Constitution for the United States shall revert to the several States individually. Any future government of the United States of America shall require ratification of three quarters of the States seeking to form a government of the United States of America and shall not be binding upon any State not seeking to form such a government; and


That copies of this resolution be transmitted by the house clerk to the President of the United States, each member of the United States Congress, and the presiding officers of each State’s legislature.

Very interesting stuff. The media are being very slow to pick up on it too.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:11 am

Arizona have passed a potentially secessionary resolution as well and now someone else said up to nine states have done this ... Could it be something to do with gun laws - is this Government going to confiscate people's guns ? They wouldn't go gentle into that good night .. .

Quote :


New Hampshire Reclaims State Supremacy

by Gary Wood (conservative libertarian), Tuesday, February 3, 2009

Leading by example the people of New Hampshire have boldly put the federal government on notice with HCR 6 - A Resolution affirming States' rights based on Jeffersonian principles.

Can you imagine any state in today's economic turmoil putting the federal government on notice? Well, that is exactly what New Hampshire has done and all other states should follow their example. With their House Concurrent Resolution they've spelled out exactly what violations will no longer be tolerated. More over the resolution doesn't stop at a mere legislative warning but carries it to the executive and judicial realms as well. Listen to the language from the resolution; hear it echo in your mind.


http://transsylvaniaphoenix.blogspot.com/2009/02/new-hampshire-reclaims-state-supremacy.html


In 1799 Thomas Jefferson laid out New Hampshire's right for this resolution when he said;

"RESOLVED: That the principle and construction contended for by sundry of the state legislatures, that the general government is the exclusive judge of the extent of the powers delegated to it, stop nothing short of despotism; since the discretion of those who administer the government, and not the constitution, would be the measure of their powers: That the several states who formed that instrument, being sovereign and independent, have the unquestionable right to judge of its infraction; and that a nullification, by those sovereignties, of all unauthorized acts done under colour of that instrument, is the rightful remedy."

http://www.nolanchart.com/article5941.html
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:21 am

I have been watching this for some time and it is numerous states. It is a complicated subject and I will return to it
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:24 am

This will all take a while to digest. But it looks to me like the Patriot Act is about to be gutted. There seems to be a real and substantial fear too of martial law. They're telling big business and foreign interests to take a long walk off a short pier too.

An interesting start to the Obama presidency.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:26 am

youngdan wrote:
I have been watching this for some time and it is numerous states. It is a complicated subject and I will return to it

What do you mean watching it for some time - for the last twenty four hours or 10 years ??

How important or significant is this ? Is it a warning issued to the Federal Government only or have they seceded ? I think it's a warning at the minute....

How many states are there now ?
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:27 am

As a matter of interest what happens to Federal debt if states do secede? If for the sake of arguement there was no UNITED States, where do the bailiffs go?
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:32 am

Squire wrote:
As a matter of interest what happens to Federal debt if states do secede? If for the sake of arguement there was no UNITED States, where do the bailiffs go?

Laughing

They'd (each creditor) have to visit at least 50 courtrooms and even then, figuring out who owes what might prove interesting.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:38 am

Hermes wrote:
Squire wrote:
As a matter of interest what happens to Federal debt if states do secede? If for the sake of arguement there was no UNITED States, where do the bailiffs go?

Laughing

They'd (each creditor) have to visit at least 50 courtrooms and even then, figuring out who owes what might prove interesting.

This is mad stuff. Are they repudiating their debts with this so ? It's California who racked up all the debt and other states don't want to bail them out ...

Mad stuff ...
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:44 am

Auditor #9 wrote:
Hermes wrote:
Squire wrote:
As a matter of interest what happens to Federal debt if states do secede? If for the sake of arguement there was no UNITED States, where do the bailiffs go?

Laughing

They'd (each creditor) have to visit at least 50 courtrooms and even then, figuring out who owes what might prove interesting.

This is mad stuff. Are they repudiating their debts with this so ? It's California who racked up all the debt and other states don't want to bail them out ...

Mad stuff ...

I don't think so Audi, at least not yet. It all seems to be a warning about future behaviour. But depending on the reception and upon whether many other States follow with similar actions, that could all change in the blink of an eye. Whatever happens next, three parties in particular (other than other Americans) will be feeling anxious. Israel, Saudi Arabia and China.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:58 am

Quote :
I don't think so Audi, at least not yet. It all seems to be a warning about future behaviour. But depending on the reception and upon whether many other States follow with similar actions, that could all change in the blink of an eye. Whatever happens next, three parties in particular (other than other Americans) will be feeling anxious. Israel, Saudi Arabia and China.
Time to start stockpiling the food so is it ?

Really, the mind boggles at the implications of this ... was just thinking about China today too... That little rice picking woman in the paddy who squirreled away her remnimbi and then decided to take a gamble towards her golden years, found that her money went to the US from where it was multiplied ten hundred thousandfold and administered to mortgage brokerages all over Europe, a large slice of which ended up in one Shane Fitzpeter's Angles Are the Irish Bank where it was multiplied further and given out to small princes who built wonderful palaces which they would sell onto the peasants for vast fortunes, servicing their debts into the bargain and showing the Chinese how a ricewoman's money could be expanded for her and returned to her proudly, her modest sum grown out of all proportion to the initial investiment due to the tremendous natural capital of the west with its potential for growth and advancement.

She never saw a renminbi penny again, poor lady .
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:02 am

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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:11 am

This might be getting some knickers in a twist:

Eu welcomes Obama's call to remove protectionist aspects of recovery bill (appears in this morning's edition of the Times): LINK.

Though it doesn't seem to be the whole of the issue, not by a long shot.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:21 am

No need for alarm Audi. No body is going anyplace for the moment. I have followed the trend for years. Obama and the economic crisis is turbo-charging it. I may have to abandon the keyboard and take to the hills at any moment
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:27 am

Hermes wrote:
This might be getting some knickers in a twist:

Eu welcomes Obama's call to remove protectionist aspects of recovery bill (appears in this morning's edition of the Times): LINK.

Though it doesn't seem to be the whole of the issue, not by a long shot.
Could it be something to do with overseas profits and the corporations that make them not wanting to surrender more profit than they have to ?

Quote :
“I don’t think Congress should repeat the 2004 repatriation until we’ve had a chance to take a closer look at what really happened the last time around.”

Pfizer, Hewlett-Packard, IBM and Eli Lilly are among the multinationals that have lobbied energetically for a tax holiday on overseas earnings, which could save them billions of dollars if they repatriate profits.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:36 am

Auditor #9 wrote:
Hermes wrote:
This might be getting some knickers in a twist:

Eu welcomes Obama's call to remove protectionist aspects of recovery bill (appears in this morning's edition of the Times): LINK.

Though it doesn't seem to be the whole of the issue, not by a long shot.
Could it be something to do with overseas profits and the corporations that make them not wanting to surrender more profit than they have to ?

Quote :
“I don’t think Congress should repeat the 2004 repatriation until we’ve had a chance to take a closer look at what really happened the last time around.”

Pfizer, Hewlett-Packard, IBM and Eli Lilly are among the multinationals that have lobbied energetically for a tax holiday on overseas earnings, which could save them billions of dollars if they repatriate profits.

That's part of it I'd say. But I think the potential loss of this might have some on the warpath:
Quote :
A Senate version of the Bill includes “Buy American” provisions that requires all manufactured products bought with federal money to be sourced from US companies.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:21 am

http://www.dailypaul.com/node/81631


This will lead you Audi to plenty of reading. It involves the 10th ammendment to the US Constitution. It is a very clever plan of action at the earliest stages. It is not suited for easy understanding here but you will get a jist or what they are about.

They are not talking secession but if the amendment was strictly adhered to then it would be as if the states were independent except for a few areas which would be the business of the federal government..

It has little traction at the moment but when the bailouts bring the calamity they guarantee will happen then it could be a different kittle of fish.


Practically anything might happen quite quickly in my opinion
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:57 am


http://www.populistamerica.com/10th_amendment

That's the text of the tenth amendment in blue above from a site I googled. I realise from WIKI that it was Amended into the Constitution in 1791 but wouldn't you think they'd put it into more contemporary terms ??? Amazing that a single line of a legal document like that can be very baffling.

The WIKI entry is full of legal jargon and other weird stuff too:


http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tenth_Amendment_to_the_United_States_Constitution


Do ye know what it means that Resolutions were passed - HCR6 for New Hampshire and HCR2025 for Arizona - does that mean that that 10th Amendment gets invoked or switched on or something scratch

It's not easy, the Law.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 12:22 pm

Very interesting lads. Reading Jefferson in the morning is always refreshing. The power of the state should be upheld.
I believe that Ron Paul has the corrrect interpretation here.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 3:20 pm

Whaddaya think Youngdan. Is this the incentive to start running for the hills? Australia threatens US with trade war.

Might act as a bit of a wake up call for our Gobshites too. 400,000 to 500,000 unemployment by year's end my arse. More like 1,000,000 to 1,100,000.

I'd say we'll see the rats appear from the lower decks any day now. Getting close to the time for the call of "Abandon ship!"
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 4:12 pm

Would some nice person mind telling Stoopid here exactly WHAT actions or future actions the New Hampshire legislature are objecting to??
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:31 pm

expat girl wrote:
Would some nice person mind telling Stoopid here exactly WHAT actions or future actions the New Hampshire legislature are objecting to??


Would I be accurate in saying the below in Bold or the potential of the below to be implemented ? From Hermes' post above:

That any Act by the Congress of the United States, Executive Order of the President of the United States of America or Judicial Order by the Judicatories of the United States of America which assumes a power not delegated to the government of United States of America by the Constitution for the United States of America and which serves to diminish the liberty of the any of the several States or their citizens shall constitute a nullification of the Constitution for the United States of America by the government of the United States of America. Acts which would cause such a nullification include, but are not limited to:


I. Establishing martial law or a state of emergency within one of the States comprising the United States of America without the consent of the legislature of that State.


II. Requiring involuntary servitude, or governmental service other than a draft during a declared war, or pursuant to, or as an alternative to, incarceration after due process of law.


III. Requiring involuntary servitude or governmental service of persons under the age of 18 other than pursuant to, or as an alternative to, incarceration after due process of law.


IV. Surrendering any power delegated or not delegated to any corporation or foreign government.


V. Any act regarding religion; further limitations on freedom of political speech; or further limitations on freedom of the press.


VI. Further infringements on the right to keep and bear arms including prohibitions of type or quantity of arms or ammunition; and


That should any such act of Congress become law or Executive Order or Judicial Order be put into force, all powers previously delegated to the United States of America by the Constitution for the United States shall revert to the several States individually. Any future government of the United States of America shall require ratification of three quarters of the States seeking to form a government of the United States of America and shall not be binding upon any State not seeking to form such a government; and


That copies of this resolution be transmitted by the house clerk to the President of the United States, each member of the United States Congress, and the presiding officers of each State’s legislature.
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:33 pm

Does anyone think that we should declare Unilateral Independence from the United States too?
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PostSubject: Re: The United States of America - New Hampshire reclaims State Supremecy   Thu Feb 05, 2009 11:18 pm

Yeah, I read that stuff above... it's pretty vague and covers a lot of bases. So they're reminding the Government they could fail to co-operate with federal initiatives. What I wanna know is what do they see coming down the tracks at them that they don't like the look of?? They must have a few specific fears in mind. What, specifically, do they think they'd like to not co-operate with?? Bailing out California?? Citigroup?? Not putting the Buy American clause in the bailout bill after all?? Que pasa?
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